Live Discussion: Email Sequencing Secrets (Audio & Transcript)

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Gary: Hey everybody its Gary and we’re back for another episode of Brainstorming Counts. What’s going on Paul?

Paul: Hey not much, just enjoying life, it actually is sunny here in the beautiful Northwest, so we both are enjoying some sun.

Gary: Yeah, I saw you took a recent trip down to San Diego, so you had a little more down there too.

Paul: Yeah a little more sun there at a Clickbank event.

Yeah going to that ClickBank marketing, that really really good opportunity.

Gary: Looked like a lot of fun!

Paul: It was.

Gary: So I thought what we might cover today is something I really don’t see covered really all that much. I’m sure it is by some people but I just haven’t seen a lot on it and that’s actual sequencing of e-mails that go out, like for one of your product launches or just maybe even if you’re promoting for affiliate products themselves.

And I’ve kind of paid a lot of attention to how you promote those products and I wonder if you could just cover how you sequence those… I think there’s probably part art and part science involved in it. Is there a certain order that you normally go through or some sort of template that you follow when you’re launching your products?

Paul: Yeah I have a template that kind of starts off like the first email especially when it’s my own products because my list is already established to know who I am. I always start that off with my brand new product is live, just release this, that type of angle, to let them know that, hey I need to check this out because I like his products and I’m going to jump on it. So I usually get a good flood of sales just kind of using that angle and my new product is live and if I’m promoting as an affiliate, I might talk about who it is that I’ve worked with before and generally when it comes to timing during the day I’ve realized obviously with our list in this Internet marketing space and any niche market for that matter… I mean you have people all over the world, all over the globe and they check emails at different times. And so I now actually will mail two or three times a day and it seems like overkill but it’s interesting to me, you actually get, there is certain times a day where some people won’t even see it. So you might think oh I’m emailing my list two times a day during this launch. They’re going to get so mad at me but the reality is they really aren’t because half of them don’t even see it because they’re asleep right… and it gets buried by the time they wake up. So I really like find for me, this kind of a cool little tip, but for me any day of the launch period about nine o’clock Pacific time. So that’s about midnight Eastern has really been a sweet spot for me with e-mails.

And I think a lot of that’s because if you look at that time frame about nine pm, it’s about five to six A.M. in the U.K. times so people are just starting to wake up on that side of the world. People in like Vietnam, the Asian countries at that point they’re already like well into their day it’s almost noon there, you’ve got Australia that’s been up for a while and then about nine is when people are starting to wind down on the Pacific Coast of the U.S. and then midnight you’ve got a lot of people in the East Coast still awake, maybe just going to bed, checking their e-mail for the last time. So that nine P.M. time has been a really good sweet spot for me for sending out e-mail promotions and I use that with any launch and if there’s really an affiliate product I really want to just sell well and I’m intentional about it, then I’ll make sure to schedule for about that time around nine, nine thirty Pacific Time. So anywhere from about midnight to twelve thirty Eastern Time am. So that’s a really good tip for people but then other times throughout the day, I don’t really have a specific time frame, I mean usually it’s kind of like when I’m sitting down at the computer and get the chance to do it, but part of the content I’m providing though, there is a method to that. And so sometimes about day two or three into the promotion I will typically come out with like a Frequently Asked Questions type angle, or something that like I do on their most recent launch of arbor cash, you saw that F.A.Q. email I sent out. And that’s kind of an e-mail just explaining, here are some basic questions we have about this product and if you don’t have a whole list of questions from customers that you’re getting, go ahead and just think of some common questions people might have, our common objections they are going to have and then answer those in there.

So those are just some ideas you can hit, but it kind of just is another way to reintroduce the product and explain it again and I find that just being consistent really makes a difference. If you’re doing like an affiliate promotion, adding a bonus works extremely well maybe adding an additional bonus that they take action now, maybe an additional webinar, you kind of gauge how your promotion is going but you can actually add something to it, to give you another excuse to mail out and then as the launch is closing it doesn’t matter if you’re doing an affiliate promotion or if you’re doing your own product launch, urgency sells and urgency is really what you want to tap into. So for me we play off that urgency and every one of our promotions. And it’s not a gimmick or a sales, it’s a sales tactic. It’s not a game we’re playing I mean we actually do raise our price and we do sell it for higher after that, but there’s a reason we do that. Some people would say why don’t you just leave the product the same. We’ve got a few customers who message us saying well what’s with you marketers doing that? Well it’s because people don’t want to lose out. The fear of losing out is a big psychological trigger for people and plain psychology is huge in marketing. And so we know that people are fearful of missing out on something, so even as kids we’re wired that way. I mean you if my kids find out that their brother or sister is outside having fun, they’re thinking oh I might be missing out on some fun so I better go do that or that’s why kids even at a young age have a hard time going to bed because they don’t want to miss out on something fun somebody else might do. And so we’re wired that way and so play on that in your emails and typically do not be afraid to send three sometimes four e-mails in that last day with different angles.

And what I find that really works well, especially for affiliate promotions and also my own launches is about an hour and a half before close I’ll do a final e-mail blast and it’s just kind of says look, this deal is ending, take action now, last call, it’s usually my shortest email. There is no need to resell the product, it’s really just getting the click at that point. So that’s why you want to make your email as quick and short as you can and it’s just like, hey this deal I’ve been telling you about all week it’s going to end, click right now check it out. And it’s a really good approached to take. And so I kind of like that sequence. So the first day I usually do a couple emails to open it up, maybe the second or third day I just provide a different angle and I’m always looking for a new angle because I don’t want my list to get tired of seeing me mail the same stuff over and over again. A few times I’ll use aWeber’s feature, aweber as a great feature. I mean I know especially Infusionsoft, they’ve got this, get response as this. You can actually mail all the people that did not open the previous email right. So I’ll typically do an e-mail blast, maybe partway through the first day and I will mail only the un-opens and I’ll keep the exact same e-mail but I’ll just change the subject line because if they haven’t opened the email then of course they haven’t seen the email, what’s in the email so much as change the subject line, maybe that will trigger an open or maybe it’s a different time for them. So that’s a good approach to do as well, kind of mail those un-opens and then you’re going to find, sometimes I’ll get about the same amount of clicks I got the first time, but the best part is I’m not actually mailing people that haven’t seen the email. So it’s not like people are going to feel oh I’m been bombarded. Well they never even saw it so there’s no harm in re sending them another message.

Another great tactic that I’ve uses as the launch is about to end. You can also mail the opens from maybe day one, day two, day three. You could actually do another mail to those that have opened that email and then you could just mail to them a very specific e-mail, says I know you’re interested in this, you should probably act now. That approach works well because you already know they’re interested enough to check it out but maybe they haven’t taken action so then you can just hit them one more time with a little different angle and that way it kind of makes them stop and go whoa I better check this out.

Gary: That’s pretty cool. So do you find, since you’re mailing them, maybe an hour or two before maybe an offer closes. Do you find you get a huge spike in sales that way versus like maybe the first day?

Paul: Yeah typically I get a lot more on the close than I do the first day and it just proved itself even on the last launch I just did AriCash, I mean it’s just natural the last day always exceeds the first day and sometimes it’s almost doubles the days in the middle of the launch, of the promotion. So even as an affiliate I find I get a massive surge towards the end as well.

Gary: Because I know I do that myself sometimes, I look at it and was like oh let me think about it. It’s that clock ticking and the people that you know are serious about raising the price and it does make you think and it does make you buy, even if you’re on the fence and that’ll definitely push you over to go ahead and push the buy button and make that purchase.

Paul: It will and it’s kind of a combination, the fear of missing out and then also the other reason you want to be use the urgency play in any of your marketing and that even goes down to your product launches, is because people are naturally, the best word to use is sometimes by nature I don’t know what it is, but by nature sometimes we like to put things off, so we procrastinate a little bit. Not everybody but a lot of people they procrastinate until the last minute and it’s just human nature. So you need to send those last call emails because you are going to get, because I’m the same way. I do the same thing sometimes where I find myself, I’ll wait until the last minute, go oh I better buy this product because for whatever reason day one it came out I was really interested and then life happened and then all of a sudden I’m getting the last call email about a week later. I’m going oh that’s right I should’ve bought this earlier. So then you rush in and buy it, but if they didn’t send the last call email I never would’ve bought that product. So it’s a really good thing because a lot of people may remember it earlier but they just didn’t take action at that time.

Gary: Yeah I know quite a few people have made a lot of money off me doing that. And it’s interesting that you brought up the, ‘your questions answered’ because that was actually something I had on my list here. Do you typically get a lot of interaction from people? I mean I know you have your most commonly asked questions or what you think that the customers might want to ask, but do you ever send emails out, like e-mail me back with your questions or is there any interaction when you just send ‘your questions answered’ email out?

Paul: Yeah, we sometimes will add that at the end and we do get some questions throughout the launch too. So I do stay tuned to my inbox and I recently changed over to my one email that I was using, it was just so inundated with spam that I made the big mistake of like that one ended up on people’s e-mail lists and all kinds of stuff. So I was missing customer support site changed to a very dedicated e-mail that only my customers get and that’s it. So if I’m getting an e-mail there it’s coming for a reason right. So from a customer or you can send them to like Zendesk or your own support desk, but it works really well to kind of just get that feedback because people naturally, even if you’re not asking for their interaction they naturally will ask questions about the product. Even our last launch we were able to work e-mail angle around a question. They kept asking us and again I’d get three or four e-mails on the same topic, so then you go oh, well he’s not the only one, well there’s another one okay well maybe we should address this right. And so the big concern was well how much is this going to cost me? How much is this, the start-up cost. So they know the product cost but they want to know how much in paid advertising am I going to have to spend, am I going to have to spend thousands of dollars, am I going to have to spend just ten dollars, that kind of thing to get started. So they kept asking that question so we addressed the F A Q’s in another e-mail. So that’s a great strategy, it’s kind of come up with those angles too that you can think of during a promotion that are going to make you stand out a little bit. And so again that would be okay these are common questions I’m getting, let’s address that, but actually asking for that interaction is a really good tactic and then also that I found and also from hearing from another guy, he’s actually one of the top guys at Maropost, which is a big e-mail deliverability and I heard him speaking on this topic and he was talking about how if you reply, if enough customers are replying to your e-mail it will actually help your inboxing tremendously and I’ve actually found that with my email as well. So yeah it will actually help you’re inboxing and so sometimes it’s good every once in a while to send an email that encourages people to respond to you.

So I did that recently with a coaching offer I did and I got a bunch of people that were then replying to my email, wanting to know more details. Instead of just giving them the details I wanted to help them make that extra step of action but also encourage them to reply. So a good way to do that. This kind of an email deliverability tip. Now I haven’t tried this yet but actually now that I’m saying it I should, but one idea is you could take a P.D.F. link to a free report or something and you want to encourage people to take actions. So you say reply to this email, reply to me and don’t make it an autoresponder, make it so you personally reply. Reply to me with your, reply and say you want it and I’ll send it to you, I’ll send you a copy and that’s a great way to get people on your list to engage with you about what happens. Gmail, Yahoo, they monitor all that stuff. So they see that if you’re hitting reply to their email, their robots view it like you’re a friend to them in a sense. So you’re like a friend, you’re not like company because Amazon.com is not going to interact with their customers that way. So they view it like oh okay this guy’s, it’s like e-mailing from a friend. So then if enough e-mails come through and I don’t know they number the threshold they look at, I really don’t, it’s all science to me but there are certain point where you’ll be white listed in Gmail for the next week. And I’ve actually found that as I’ve done more that I’ll send my emails lo and behold are now showing up in Gmail for that week.

There’s been times where my e-mails couldn’t be found in Gmail right and then all of a sudden maybe after I do some of that all of a sudden they’re getting discovered. So they have their systems e-mail, the big e-mail company. So that’s another positive reason to ask for that feedback but also just look for those angles and since we’re talking about like e-mail sequencing, another key thing we like to do is before a launch or in the middle of a launch. I don’t care if I’m being an affiliate or it’s my own product… I look at what’s happening in the news, what’s happening in the news, what’s a current event, what holiday are we around, like for example we just launched great timing because it was March Madness for N.C.A.A basketball and in America it’s a huge deal, they call it March Madness. So again we’re able to kind of play off, well we must be mad because we’re making this amazing product available, that kind of angle right. So you can do that and then we also did St Patrick’s Day. Well hey that was I mean great timing for us because we had St Patrick’s Day and March madness, so we could play off that angle. I’ve got a launch coming up about mid-April so I’m going to have the tax angle that I can use. Now I don’t know what angle I’m going to go for but I’ll figure it out. We’ll figure out a way to angle and stock video with the tax man, but you just have to think of your surroundings. Is it Mother’s Day, is it Father’s Day coming up. Those are really unique angles because it gives you another excuse to mail. Maybe if you’re in the middle of a launch that happens on Mother’s Day you could do a simple, hey we’re going to take an additional five percent off today off this launch because it’s Mother’s Day and we all love our mothers you know something like that, that’s just a way to kind of just keep it fresh. You don’t want to get stale, you don’t want to send the same email day after day after day for the launch. You want to just keep your e-mails fresh, keep your angles fresh, it’s a really important strategy.

Gary: Okay that’s some really great advice just real quick, what are some of the biggest things that you found that have not worked for some of your approaches with email marketing?

Paul: Yeah so some of my mistakes with email marketing have been, like making the mistake of just kind of being lazy and copying and pasting the same e-mail and sending it a few days in a row. Or not lazy but maybe just the time or whatever time gets all of you, you don’t have time to sit down and write a unique angle. So that hasn’t worked the best. The other issue I’ve had is, if you promote too many products and not only have I done this but I’ve seen a lot of guys do it and I know the results are no good because they pushed for me and I can see that they’re not getting great results. And that’s emailing for multiple promotions at the same exact time. I mean there are times where it makes sense. In fact one marketer I know she does a fantastic job of this but she’ll do a weekly recap and I think that’s a really good angle because they’re list kind of expects but about Sunday night, she’s going to be sending out a weekly recap. And she’ll put four or five products she promoted that week and so I can see that working but if you’re trying to promote and I’ve got this offer and I’ve got that offer and this offer… that’s just too much right. So only do that if you’re going to do the weekly recap and just do it once a week. So trying to promote too many products at once is a big mistake that just dilutes the value of what you’re sending and another thing too is kind of mix it up, it’s really important I know this is talking about, I guess what not to do, but for me just another tidbit is mix it up between short and long emails. You’d be surprised how a shorter email can actually get a really good response but then a long email there’s a place for those too because they can explain the offer a little bit more. And so it’s funny too because I know some guys they’re strictly long form e-mail guys. You’ll get a four or five page document that looks like in an email and then there’s other guys that will send like what is it, maybe ten words in the entire email. I mean it’s just like Wow. And that’s all they send you know.

I’m more of along the lines of mixing it up and I think that’s good because I think you’re list would get stale and kind of tired of that after a while. So those are some other mistakes I’ve seen other people make. And for me also not being another big mistake is, I’ve made this mistake basically and I’ve lost contests because I didn’t do that last minute email. So it’s kind of like what I was telling you guys about the last call. There’s been a few contestswhere I actually found out I was in second place three sales from first place but I failed to do my last call e-mail that very well could have pushed me over the top and gave me the top prize. So there are those moments and I still have made those mistakes and now it’s taught me okay, do not miss out on the last call. Even if you’re in the running or not for competition you’re going to make sales. So you’re leaving money on the table if you do not do the last call.

Gary: Really good advice. So I appreciate your time today I think we’re going to wrap it up. Just some really really good stuff in there. So I guess that’s all for this time on this edition of Brainstorming Counts and we will see you guys next time.

Paul: Awesome I really enjoyed it.